What is this Mills Machine (Name and Date) Real or Repro

[sam2002]

Cash box is repro . Is the back door smooth ?

[sam2002]

Be very wary of these aitkins fronts most of these are reproductions . Do your homework before considering buying this machine .
I see it is listed on ebay for $1495 way to high for a machine that has not been determined to be authentic

[nvmos2]

[quote="Anglobritish"]Guy's,
I think you will find that the repro models had a single cherry payout, the original Extra Bell only paid out on two cherry combinations.

There is a copy of an original Extrabell flyer in Lemons Cherries and Gum; it shows a machine with single cherry pay.

Smokin427, same ID that started this thread, is the flebay seller;
he identifies the machine as "Antique c1946 Mills Extra Bell Atkins Front" and makes no mention that it is probably a reproduction from much later.
Very disingenuous of you do do that, Smokin427; not cool.

[smokin427]

I am not trying to fool anyone. If you read all the responses plus the other research I have done, I still do not know for sure. It says these were manufactured 1946 to 1951. Research says repros have single horizontal bars and single verticle bars and single cherry payout but this has none of those. On the other hand the back is smooth and the handle looks like a possible repro. I do not think I have a definite answer yet. I will tell anyone who asks on Ebay what I know and if my price is too high, it will not sell and I will adjust accordingly. It is a beautiful machine and works great. A lot of people are like me and just want one that looks great and works great for their game room and are not collectors. You got to admit it is pretty cool. I will take out the word antique from the title on Ebay.

[sam2002]

I have owned both repro aitkins as well as 2 original aitkins . I wish to heck I would have made notes but the reproduction aluminum front casting is around a 1/2 " narrower than the original .

[nvmos2]

I am not trying to fool anyone. If you read all the responses plus the other research I have done, I still do not know for sure. It says these were manufactured 1946 to 1951. Research says repros have single horizontal bars and single verticle bars and single cherry payout but this has none of those. On the other hand the back is smooth and the handle looks like a possible repro. I do not think I have a definite answer yet. I will tell anyone who asks on Ebay what I know and if my price is too high, it will not sell and I will adjust accordingly. It is a beautiful machine and works great. A lot of people are like me and just want one that looks great and works great for their game room and are not collectors. You got to admit it is pretty cool. I will take out the word antique from the title on Ebay.

LOL.... Your flebay listing leaves out the info you have here and apparently from other sources.
Withholding that info until a potential buyer asks is pretty much the definition of disingenuous.
Many buyers don't know anything about this model or what questions to ask.

As a minimum, you should include;
what you've learned about the back door, cash box, and handle.
The fact that there is a high possibility that it is a reproduction; previous sales/auctions show there are probably more reproductions of this model than there are originals.
As indicated above, the patina of this machine shouts Reproduction.
If there is any part original Extrabell here, the machine has been completely restored to include new reel strips and wood.
No telling where the mechanism came from.
Yes, the original kits were produced 1946-51, but reproductions were made for many years, probably starting in the 80s.
What history/info do you have from the previous owner when you acquired it.

Your research may help me and maybe others here to expand our knowledge;
When you say repros have single horizontal and single vertical bars, I don't know what you are talking about;
please explain and where did you get that info?
How do you know repros all have single cherry payout?
In photos above, there is a sticker on the inside of the case on the left and maybe another on the right side; could you post a photo of the stickers (that could be very helpful)?

[nvmos2]

The seller has revised the listing for this machine, but still hasn’t got it quite right. But that is certainly understandable:
“For some reason, the Etrabell has generated what may be the biggest outpouring of inaccuracies and pure bull to ever grace the written record of any slot machine ever made.” D. Bueschel

IMO, this machine is not an original Extrabell; here’s why:

Extrabell made their own castings, they would not have stamped an MLB number into them as shown in photo above.
The base should have the reenforcing rods and skids, this machine appears to have a new replacement base with neither.
The Extrabell had drill proof plates; this machine does not and has what looks to be a Mills inspection sticker inside; if that’s what it is, Extrabell would not put a Mills sticker in there.
I know the Extrabell came in chartreuse and turquoise; don’t know what other colors they offered, but Royal Bell made reproductions in burgundy as shown here.
I don’t think Extrabell included the back door, so the revamper would use a Mills back door and lock. This machine has a smooth metal door.

I don’t know if Extrabells had serial numbers or other distinctive stampings in the castings;
there are 2 serials in the data base;
one is very low (174) and could be an Extrabell number;
the other is very high (523xxx) and looks like a Mills number.
The issues is further confused since Baker Novelty ended up making their own Extrabell castings.
If there are no distinctive stampings in the castings, perhaps the only way to tell a reproduction is to measure for shrinkage, as stated by sam2002.

The mechanism is a secondary issue since Extrabell did not produce mechanisms; their kit would accommodate any Mills Silent mechanism to the Black Cherry model.
It appears the seller of this machine got his info on reproductions from this forum and Dave’s website; it’s good info, but can be misapplied to an Extrabell;
since the kit would accommodate any Mills Silent mechanism,
an Extrabell can have a variety of payouts, including single cherry.
I assume the vertical and horizontal bars the seller refers to are the coin and check detector levers on the mechanism and escalator.
Since the revamper provided the mechanism and escalator, an original Extrabell may or may not have check detector levers (maybe even vice-versa).
I know of one original with a chain drive escalator.

It’s been a long time since I’ve looked at an original Extrabell and I only know what I read, I’m hoping somebody here with a known original machine or contemporary advertising can confirm/correct/add to my assertions. That’s what makes this forum a great source of info.

[sam2002]

I am not absolutely 100 percent sure on what I am about to state but I thought extrabell castings were what the extrabell co. made . These were then put onto a cabinet and mech made by Mills . As I recall hearing not sure if it is correct but the aluminum these are made from was in short supply (possibly due to the war effort )so the castings were made of old castings that were melted down .the design of the machine is supposedly modeled after the scroll work that might be seen on an officers uniform . I am not saying any of this is documented but I did do a lot of homework on these because as stated earlier I have owned 2 originals and ,one fake I bought on ebah . This fake from ebah the seller went to great lengths to disguise as the castings we're added to a cabinet with drill plates and also had the locking door behind the cash box as well as an original Mills back door and the mills sticker had been removed . I looked and looked for information on the so called aitkins front and finally a gent that lives in Ca someone with world class credentials informed me that the repros castings are narrower . I then measured the castings on my 2 units and alas the one from ebay was narrower . Bill from our forum knows the gent from the Bay Area that I am referring to .
I eventually found an original 25 cent extrabell in Mariposa county at a winery . I was able to purchase this as well as a bursting cherry from the owner who told me his great grandchildren had outgrown the machines .
The extrabell is a tough machine to find accurate info on and I also would say without hesitancy the one on ebah is a reproduction due to the back door , longer handle and other inconsistencies .dont buy that one as a collectors piece . it would be fine for a game room or for the grand kids but the price is to high .
I wish I had kept better notes on those machines Buried somewhere on my computer perhaps I will find some extra time and locate those dimensions ..........

[nvmos2]

From the write up in !00 Slots, Vol 2 and the contemporary ad in Lemons, Cherries, & BF Gum, page 182;
it seems clear that Extrabell made a complete cabinet (except for back door?) to replace and update the look of older Mills machines.
Basically just using the escalator and mechanism (and back door?) from the Mills machine.

From the ad:
"The complete Extrabell assembly ......includes all aluminum front, top and bottom, payout cup, top back, rails, white oak cabinet, drill proof lining, club handle, denominator plate, chrome plated reward plate."

Of course, if someone wanted to buy just the castings and not the whole assembly,
Extrabell would probably accommodate them (unless they wanted to maintain quality control of how the Extrabell looked overall).

The design of the castings was new to the slot business, but the Bach book does mention that it may have been influenced by the hat/uniform of General D. MacArthur,
who was immensely popular in the post war years when Extrabell was introduced.

[JHSS-1944]

I really hate to add more confusion.....
First, we all agree this seller asked questions here, got tons of information And chose to pick what he wanted ,to help sell a reproduction machine and NOT state it was a reproduction.

Now THIS..... an EXTRA BELL was shown on this forum not long ago, No one had any thing bad to say about it And it was a Golden Nugget conversion (for lack of a better word). the owner posted a few very nice photos of it. I thought he stated it's casting was made of Brass.... "gold leaves , & the paint job over it". which means ...another casting maker made these ???

Yes I know reproductions of this also made & everywhere for sale, usually for stupid money !

can't recall the member, but he posted his fake that He changed up to a Jake Daniels themed machine. he stated the casting & wood were made in Mexico (unknown casting markings ,if any).
My fake ; cast markings are EXTRABELL, AANCIENT. of Nevada. one would assume casting a remold of another fake , so size might be real off from a rare original. inside most ,if not all the parts are mills part # coded (even the disks)
white paint with the chrome ,& a 2 cherry pay out (25 cent).

thanks to Everyone who provided information about the originals !!!!! (& the various reproductions).
jeff H.